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Pagani Huayra Top Gear (Spoiler Alert)

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  #111  
Old 02-22-2013, 11:30 AM
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elhimiel has a little shameless behaviour in the past
I can't help but laugh at the direction this thread has taken, with the Pagani shills starting it in grand celebratory fashion as if they had won a Tour de France to wimpering out into supporting what started this whole discussion on tires and the seriousness of Top Gear's lackluster science.

Even more hysterical is how Pagani cheated with semi-slicks but wouldn't settle so hand carved a set with racing compound on top of that. They cheated on top of the cheat! Top Gear must love this because you just know they must have had a lengthy discussion on whether they should allow the semi-slicks, lol!

This is how fishy it is to call these street tires. Notice the key markers in wet traction and hydro planing resistance. The tires are useless in day to day driving and particularly so in the UK.

Pirelli - PZero - 295/35ZR20 XL Porsche Panamera / GTS / S / 4 / 4S / Turbo - Pneus - PMC Tire, Québec, Ontario, Canada
Pirelli - PZero Corsa - 295/30ZR19 Right XL Aston Martin V12 Vantage / Zagato - Pneus - PMC Tire, Québec, Ontario, Canada

And even if the Pagani shills gets their way with sematics then as mattjs pointed out the threads still don't match the thread pattern or the indicator dots.





A gentle reminder. This is the THIRD time they have been caught.

1) When Andy Wallace couldn't hit 200 MPH in a Zonda S in Evo.
2) When Pagani in partnership with Evo using Pagani's factory driver made it so that the Koenigsegg CCX wasn't allowed to run Pilot Sport Cups in their hyper car test.
3) And THIS.


This is a shill for you who are curious! You call the factory boys and let us know what their PR machine says! It will be promptly sorted in the BULLSHIT file! That's what's up!

Shill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Also worth revisting, How Ferrari Spins!

How Ferrari spins

Cheating Nissan, Bitter Porsche!

Avoidable Contact #17: Cheating Nissan, Bitter Porsche. | Speed:Sport:LifeSpeed:Sport:Life


BOOOO THESE MEN!!
 
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  #112  
Old 02-22-2013, 02:59 PM
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I find this quote particularly entertaining, from a few weeks ago. I imagine Streetrod was hoping we had forgotten:

Originally Posted by streetrod454 View Post
The only real test is between cars that you and I can walk into a dealer and order with what every options that manufacturer offers. As long as the cars are street legal then the tyres should not be highlighted as a contributing factor.
We've pretty well established that the Huayra's Power Lap tires are hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks. We can also be fairly confident that Pirelli racing slicks have not been certified for road use, and are therefore not street legal, whether they have had grooves cut into them or not.

I would be delighted to see a Huayra order sheet with "hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks" declared as an available option.

It's a moot point however, because for the purposes of the Power Lap, as declared in particular by Streetrod454 (to say nothing of Mr. Clarkson parameters), any car equipped with such an option would be henceforth rendered not street legal. Therefore any car running a time in such a configuration would not be eligible for Power Lap ranking.
 

Last edited by mattjs33; 02-22-2013 at 03:04 PM.
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  #113  
Old 02-22-2013, 03:40 PM
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Pagani Shills ftw..

SHILLS

SHILLLLLLSSS
 

Last edited by La Artist; 02-22-2013 at 03:53 PM.
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  #114  
Old 02-22-2013, 06:01 PM
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elhimiel has a little shameless behaviour in the past
Originally Posted by mattjs33 View Post
I find this quote particularly entertaining, from a few weeks ago. I imagine Streetrod was hoping we had forgotten:

Originally Posted by streetrod
The only real test is between cars that you and I can walk into a dealer and order with what every options that manufacturer offers. As long as the cars are street legal then the tyres should not be highlighted as a contributing factor.
We've pretty well established that the Huayra's Power Lap tires are hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks. We can also be fairly confident that Pirelli racing slicks have not been certified for road use, and are therefore not street legal, whether they have had grooves cut into them or not.

I would be delighted to see a Huayra order sheet with "hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks" declared as an available option.

It's a moot point however, because for the purposes of the Power Lap, as declared in particular by Streetrod454 (to say nothing of Mr. Clarkson parameters), any car equipped with such an option would be henceforth rendered not street legal. Therefore any car running a time in such a configuration would not be eligible for Power Lap ranking.
Classic quote! I'm waiting for the argument that they're customized cars so everything is "standard". Like the front splitter they added to the demonstrator.



Pagani Huayra Gets New Front Splitter

And have a look at this. In Fifth Gears 0-200 MPH test, which looked incredibly unstable and painfully slow compared to their competitors (above 30 seconds or almost half as fast as the Veyron SS or Agera R), they use the FULL THREADS. At the 11:19 mark.


This is straight out of Ferrari's and Nissan's book on manipulating tests! Does anyone think they stopped at the tires and the splitter or are there MORE modifications?!?! Hands up if you think they only cheat a little bit and firmly draws the moral line at suspension and engine modifications!

Originally Posted by The Artist View Post
Pagani Shills ftw..

SHILLS

SHILLLLLLSSS
Haha! How lucky Pagani are to have someone like you who can spend every day on Teampspeed doing an INSANE amount of unpaid PR work. Lucky, lucky them. You must be very passionate about your unpaid work to spam as much as you do. Congratulations to Pagani for being able to evoke such unblemished, unpaid passion.

PAGANI

PAGAAAAANIIII
 

Last edited by elhimiel; 02-22-2013 at 06:07 PM.
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  #115  
Old 02-22-2013, 07:50 PM
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^ Who pays you for having a stick up your anus?



Aint nobody got time for dat ( arguing with you)

When you compare the 1200 hp Agera R and Veyron with a 730hp car in a straight line drag race..

that's where i throw in the towel..



Edit:

2K posts whaaaa!!!!

1.8K about pagani ..Im a shill after-all
 

Last edited by La Artist; 02-22-2013 at 08:00 PM.
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  #116  
Old 02-23-2013, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by mattjs33 View Post
I find this quote particularly entertaining, from a few weeks ago. I imagine Streetrod was hoping we had forgotten:



We've pretty well established that the Huayra's Power Lap tires are hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks. We can also be fairly confident that Pirelli racing slicks have not been certified for road use, and are therefore not street legal, whether they have had grooves cut into them or not.

I would be delighted to see a Huayra order sheet with "hand-cut Pirelli racing slicks" declared as an available option.

It's a moot point however, because for the purposes of the Power Lap, as declared in particular by Streetrod454 (to say nothing of Mr. Clarkson parameters), any car equipped with such an option would be henceforth rendered not street legal. Therefore any car running a time in such a configuration would not be eligible for Power Lap ranking.
To the contrary Matt I absolutely stand behind that quote and I thank you for highlighting it again because it is a truth. It is not up to you or me to decide what a manufacture offers on its options list. If they decide to offer a cup or corsa type tyre just like McLaren and Porsche do then that is their choice.

As for now being confident that your investigations have proven anything then I suggest you take your evidence into a court of law and see how long it will take before it is thrown out. Your evidence is circumstantial at best. Being an internet court and jury I am afraid holds little water in the real world.

A forum at the end of the day is just that, a forum, a place where people exchange views. If you feel so strongly about this then give Pagani a call and ask them yourselves. I can provide you with a number if you like
 
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  #117  
Old 02-23-2013, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by elhimiel View Post
Classic quote! I'm waiting for the argument that they're customized cars so everything is "standard". Like the front splitter they added to the demonstrator.



Pagani Huayra Gets New Front Splitter

And have a look at this. In Fifth Gears 0-200 MPH test, which looked incredibly unstable and painfully slow compared to their competitors (above 30 seconds or almost half as fast as the Veyron SS or Agera R), they use the FULL THREADS. At the 11:19 mark.

Fifth Gear Season 22 Episode 2 Part 3/3 - YouTube

This is straight out of Ferrari's and Nissan's book on manipulating tests! Does anyone think they stopped at the tires and the splitter or are there MORE modifications?!?! Hands up if you think they only cheat a little bit and firmly draws the moral line at suspension and engine modifications!



Haha! How lucky Pagani are to have someone like you who can spend every day on Teampspeed doing an INSANE amount of unpaid PR work. Lucky, lucky them. You must be very passionate about your unpaid work to spam as much as you do. Congratulations to Pagani for being able to evoke such unblemished, unpaid passion.

PAGANI

PAGAAAAANIIII
Ok I have resisted long enough, elhimiel you are a first rate idiot. How can someone who hates the Pagani brand so much then go and use a video that declares it to be the greatest car on the planet as a way of slagging it off?????

Could it be the fact no one that has actually driven or tested the car has had anything but praise for the car that you hate so much just pisses you off?

Maybe I can forgive your resentment because you live in a desert country with no race or car history, only one decent track and no motorsport industry of any significance. Your street culture which is splashed across the internet seems to consist of similar idiots doing their best to kill themselves or any unlucky bystander in drifting demonstrations on public roads.

From the moment you started posting on Teamspeed your attitude has been combative, your so called facts are never substantiated and when you are called out you chose not to answer. Most of the time you sound like a 10 year old boy/girl, I not sure which you are. If you were bullied at school and this is your way of getting back at people, it’s not working mate

Can you please just grow up
 
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  #118  
Old 02-23-2013, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by streetrod454 View Post
If they decide to offer a cup or corsa type tyre just like McLaren and Porsche do then that is their choice.

Your evidence is circumstantial at best.
Oh come now, Streetrod, I've seen you around long enough to know that you are smarter than that. If you really believe that then you are the most naive member on Teamspeed.

You've found hoofprints in the snow, and you're looking for unicorns, while being surrounded by horses.

It's not a cup or corsa type tire that was on the Huayra for its Power Lap. But I'll entertain this ridiculous notion for an exercise in logic. Let's just say that during the several years' time that Pirelli was developing the Huayra's specific PZero Corsa tire, it was simultaneously developing a set of Unicorn tires for the Huayra...

...whose existence has never before been stated by Pagani
...which are not the same size tire as what Pagani states the Huayra uses
...which carry a size designation format not used by Pirelli for street-legal tires
...which have tread indicator dots that are completely contrary to industry-wide street tire practice
...have never been seen on the Huayra before
...have no identfying markings other than size and Pirelli branding
...and which just HAPPEN to appear on the Huayra for the occasion of its Power Lap
...during which the Huayra runs a lap time nearly 4% quicker than the McLaren MP4-12C
...which compares to the only one half percent quicker lap time that it ran vs. the 12C when tested previously by EVO.

I ask you, realistically, how likely is it that all of these conditions came together so pefectly as they have in this instance?

Luckily we are not in a court of law, and burden of proof is not something I am conflicted with. I am also not interested in your contact information for Pagani (which I believe you have), because I can't imagine a scenario where a representative of that company would tell a random stranger on the phone, "Oh yeah, we put race tires on the Huayra. Spanked that McLaren but good".

What might be a good idea for me is to put some teasers out to the mainstream automotive media, and let them poke around a bit. Because this was a highly coordinated, concerted effort put forth by A LOT of people, from the tread cutters, to the techs on site at Dunsfold, to the Stig himself (surely a professional driver would be able to tell he was driving on race tires, and know how to maximize their benefit). It's going to be very difficult to keep all of these people quiet.

Is it a crime? Certainly not. As The Protest pointed out, it's just a silly TV show. But these types of things are extremely important to performance car manufacturers. If they weren't, the MP4-12C would make 250 horsepower and the Veyron would max out at 85mph. There is no more pointless automotive endeavor than the pursuit of production top speed records, yet Volkswagen saw fit to piss away millions to ensure the Veyron would top 250mph, and then millions more to get their record back when it was topped. They did this for the sole reason that there is an identifiable number of cars they were going to sell simply because it is "The Fastest Car In The World".

Sitting atop the Power Board is worth huge dollars to Pagani. What I can't fathom is why the McLaren folks aren't crying foul.

What I'd really like to know is whether this was an edict from Horatio himself, or was it one someone else in the organization? Because if it were my name on the car, that person would be on my carpet pronto. Or was it Top Gear's idea? It is entertainment after all. Whatever the case may be, someone's going to come out looking bad.

Pagani tried to pull a fast one, they got caught, get over it. Life will go on. But I'm mostly done here, there's nothing more to see. Move along.

I'm sure your unicorn will turn up eventually.
 

Last edited by mattjs33; 02-23-2013 at 01:12 PM.
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  #119  
Old 02-23-2013, 01:23 PM
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Matt in general I have no problem with anything you have said here. As I said before I congratulate you on your investigative skills.

But I am not naive believe me, I have been around the block more than once, but what that has taught me is not to take everything at face value, now in this case that can work for me or for you.

I believe in provable facts, at the moment we are having educated guesses.

It might be good idea for you to spread your theory to the wider world. If you are proven to be right I will be the first to come on here to concede my stance and give you a pat on the back.

Until then let’s drop this. They are a hell of a lot of other things we can argue about in this hobby of ours
 
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  #120  
Old 02-23-2013, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by streetrod454 View Post
Matt in general I have no problem with anything you have said here. As I said before I congratulate you on your investigative skills.

But I am not naive believe me, I have been around the block more than once, but what that has taught me is not to take everything at face value, now in this case that can work for me or for you.

I believe in provable facts, at the moment we are having educated guesses.

It might be good idea for you to spread your theory to the wider world. If you are proven to be right I will be the first to come on here to concede my stance and give you a pat on the back.
Sounds reasonable enough to me.
 
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