Pagani Huayra Top Gear (Spoiler Alert)
#131
02-27-2013, 10:08 AM
With all due respect Heartache I think the most important part of that statement is this: "equipped with Pirelli PZero Corsa specifically designed by Pirelli just for the Huayra"
A lot of the discussion on this thread as has been mainly researched by Matt and has centred around weather the tyres are hand cut slicks or genuine street tyres. Also the fact that the tyre sizes are not commonly available.
If we take Pagani's claims at face value then the above statement vindicates them. But I fully accept this is not going to satisfy the sceptics or conspiracy theorists. This argument will no doubt rumble on
A lot of the discussion on this thread as has been mainly researched by Matt and has centred around weather the tyres are hand cut slicks or genuine street tyres. Also the fact that the tyre sizes are not commonly available.
If we take Pagani's claims at face value then the above statement vindicates them. But I fully accept this is not going to satisfy the sceptics or conspiracy theorists. This argument will no doubt rumble on
What's both amusing and frustrating at the same time is those who keep telling me I don't have all the facts, or I'm assuming this or I'm assuming that. Read through this thread in a deliberate manner and you will see the evolution of my thought process and my discovery of evidence, ALL supported by photos and data on known automotive tire design practice.
And yet those who suggest that there are possibly alternate tires that we have not yet heard of, or Track Pack tires that have not yet been announced, or street legal tires that might be made with treadwear dots, or whatever fool notion they have, NONE of these theories have any factual basis or supporting evidence, and no one offering these theories has made any effort to provide any.
It's possible that the Mississippi river was formed by aliens using a big space laser to cut into the earth. But based on what we know and can see, how likely is it? Apply the same logic to this case. Again, despite what you might like to believe, what do your eyes tell you, what possiblity seems to fit best, based on what we know? That's how you find the answers.
Last edited by mattjs33; 02-27-2013 at 10:14 AM.
#132
02-27-2013, 10:11 AM
With all due respect Streetrod, but if the Power Lap tires were indeed PZero Corsas, and they were capable of generating that kind of performance, do you think Pirelli might have interest in putting "PZero" on them in big blazing white letters? Because that's what's on the tires that the red car above wears. Might Pirelli have an iterest in that type of press?
What's both amusing and frustrating at the same time is those who keep telling me I don't have all the facts, or I'm assuming this or I'm assuming that. Read through this thread in a deliberate manner and you will see the evolution of my thought process and my discovery of evidence, ALL supported by photos and data on known automotive tire design practice.
And yet those who suggest that there are possibly alternate tires, or Track Pack tires, or street legal tires with treadwear dots, or whatever fool notion they have, NONE of these theories have any factual basis or supporting evidence, and no one providing these theories has made any effort to provide any.
It's possible that the Mississippi river was formed by aliens using a big space laser to cut into the earth. But based on what we know and can see, how likely is it? Apply the same logic to this case. Again, despite what you might like to believe, what do eyes tell you, what possiblity seems to fit best, based on what we know? That's how you find the answers.
What's both amusing and frustrating at the same time is those who keep telling me I don't have all the facts, or I'm assuming this or I'm assuming that. Read through this thread in a deliberate manner and you will see the evolution of my thought process and my discovery of evidence, ALL supported by photos and data on known automotive tire design practice.
And yet those who suggest that there are possibly alternate tires, or Track Pack tires, or street legal tires with treadwear dots, or whatever fool notion they have, NONE of these theories have any factual basis or supporting evidence, and no one providing these theories has made any effort to provide any.
It's possible that the Mississippi river was formed by aliens using a big space laser to cut into the earth. But based on what we know and can see, how likely is it? Apply the same logic to this case. Again, despite what you might like to believe, what do eyes tell you, what possiblity seems to fit best, based on what we know? That's how you find the answers.
#133
02-27-2013, 10:37 AM
Look Matt I do not doubt that your line of enquiry does have credibility, so let’s not argue about that.
But you have to wonder why in this day and age where the chance of being caught out is now so strong, why would Pagani publish the statement on their website that I mentioned above? Surly the risk was not worth taking.
As for the so called track pack, yes it does exist. The new front splitter that you now see on a number of Huayra's it part of it. Here is the latest one:
As for mystery tyres, just look around the new Supercar ranks at the moment. Virtually all the new hypercars coming to the market this year will have bespoke tyres not available for any other car or yet seen. McLaren has been the latest to announce that the P1 will have a totally custom set of tyres.
Does that mean the Huayra's were never seen before custom tyre's? Not necessarily but possible. Just playing devils advocate here....
But you have to wonder why in this day and age where the chance of being caught out is now so strong, why would Pagani publish the statement on their website that I mentioned above? Surly the risk was not worth taking.
As for the so called track pack, yes it does exist. The new front splitter that you now see on a number of Huayra's it part of it. Here is the latest one:
As for mystery tyres, just look around the new Supercar ranks at the moment. Virtually all the new hypercars coming to the market this year will have bespoke tyres not available for any other car or yet seen. McLaren has been the latest to announce that the P1 will have a totally custom set of tyres.
Does that mean the Huayra's were never seen before custom tyre's? Not necessarily but possible. Just playing devils advocate here....
Last edited by streetrod454; 02-27-2013 at 10:41 AM.
#134
02-27-2013, 10:48 AM
Just to set the record straight I'd like to point out that despite what is being currently reported on CarBuzz and CARS UK, I have never suggested that Pagani might have made other tweaks to the Huayra for the purpose of the Power Lap. If those theories are out there they did not originate here.
Personally I feel the Power Lap tires alone would have been enough to produce the result that was achieved.
Personally I feel the Power Lap tires alone would have been enough to produce the result that was achieved.
#135
02-27-2013, 12:32 PM
After reading this thread and some of the comments sections on other ‘automotive news’ websites out there, well, I just have to ask: Why can’t people even question, or be allowed the right to investigate the validity of anything a "mainstream" network or TV show airs these days without being stated in the same context as a "conspiracy theorist" or skeptic? Do you really believe even 10% of the crap you hear on the BBC, MSNBC, CNN, FOX? On politics, the economy, etc.? Really?
I for one, applaud Matt for his attention to the details. We need more people like him. It only goes to show that the only true press anymore, anywhere in the world is the common man or consumer/owner of a product.
I used to work in the PR side of the automotive industry, and I know all too well of the BS & lies that go on behind the scenes. Same as a family member of mine who works for the government - we both know that most things are indeed, a conspiracy of sorts. Ask yourself, if Top Gear did know about the car being tested on different tires, do you honestly think they are going to call out Pagani on it and put that dishonesty on display for the rest of the world to see? It would destroy their reputation overnight. Just like any other manufacturer. Do you think they want to test another Pagani, ever? Of course they do. If they called out Pagani, they would most likely never be allowed to test another Pagani again.
Since the rest of the world is diving into this forum to read about this claim, let it be known that while we are all about to stroke ourselves to the unveiling of the new generation of hypercars ala ‘F150’, P1 & 918 at Geneva, understand that we will likely never see a true side-by-side comparison or even a single “Consumer Reports” type independent test of these cars in their stock, off the “showroom” floor specifications. One has to look no further than all of the evidence in the media (web, print, otherwise) over the decades in regards to car makers sending ‘cheater cars’ or teams of engineers to group & performance tests to set their car or car(s) up to avail them in the best presentable light. To give credit to the mainstream print media as of late, at least some of the magazines out there are dropping hints at what goes on behind the scenes in some of these performance tests. Chris Harris knows. As do many others in the media, as well as those employees of competing car companies. And you won’t need them to tell you of a certain car manufacturer or two with press cars making the rounds out there with setups that are definitely not what you’re going to get off the showroom floor or in the orders books.
Read between the lines. This is real and it happens. It’s not conspiracy theory.
I for one, applaud Matt for his attention to the details. We need more people like him. It only goes to show that the only true press anymore, anywhere in the world is the common man or consumer/owner of a product.
I used to work in the PR side of the automotive industry, and I know all too well of the BS & lies that go on behind the scenes. Same as a family member of mine who works for the government - we both know that most things are indeed, a conspiracy of sorts. Ask yourself, if Top Gear did know about the car being tested on different tires, do you honestly think they are going to call out Pagani on it and put that dishonesty on display for the rest of the world to see? It would destroy their reputation overnight. Just like any other manufacturer. Do you think they want to test another Pagani, ever? Of course they do. If they called out Pagani, they would most likely never be allowed to test another Pagani again.
Since the rest of the world is diving into this forum to read about this claim, let it be known that while we are all about to stroke ourselves to the unveiling of the new generation of hypercars ala ‘F150’, P1 & 918 at Geneva, understand that we will likely never see a true side-by-side comparison or even a single “Consumer Reports” type independent test of these cars in their stock, off the “showroom” floor specifications. One has to look no further than all of the evidence in the media (web, print, otherwise) over the decades in regards to car makers sending ‘cheater cars’ or teams of engineers to group & performance tests to set their car or car(s) up to avail them in the best presentable light. To give credit to the mainstream print media as of late, at least some of the magazines out there are dropping hints at what goes on behind the scenes in some of these performance tests. Chris Harris knows. As do many others in the media, as well as those employees of competing car companies. And you won’t need them to tell you of a certain car manufacturer or two with press cars making the rounds out there with setups that are definitely not what you’re going to get off the showroom floor or in the orders books.
Read between the lines. This is real and it happens. It’s not conspiracy theory.
Last edited by Zeus; 02-27-2013 at 12:35 PM.
#136
02-27-2013, 12:56 PM
Top gear called pagani out :
Top Gear has responded and they are asking Pagani about their tires.
And pagani responded:
Yes, we have heard these rumors around our record lap at TopGear. We used Pirelli PZero Trofeo. As first equipment we offer to our customers three different types of tires, all of them omologated for street use: Pirelli PZero, Pirelli PZero Corsa and Pirelli Pzero Trofeo.
Pirelli PZero Trofeo can be treated as Michelin Pilot sport cup for example.
In comparison to the times we have done at other tracks, We can say that we are still faster than the time we scored. From our calculations we are even 1.5/2 seconds faster than what we have done.
Pirelli is our partner since 2007 when we set the Record time at the Nuerburgring Nordschleife with a Zonda F, and we are developers with them regarding Pirelli PZero range of tires.
Top Gear has responded and they are asking Pagani about their tires.
And pagani responded:
Yes, we have heard these rumors around our record lap at TopGear. We used Pirelli PZero Trofeo. As first equipment we offer to our customers three different types of tires, all of them omologated for street use: Pirelli PZero, Pirelli PZero Corsa and Pirelli Pzero Trofeo.
Pirelli PZero Trofeo can be treated as Michelin Pilot sport cup for example.
In comparison to the times we have done at other tracks, We can say that we are still faster than the time we scored. From our calculations we are even 1.5/2 seconds faster than what we have done.
Pirelli is our partner since 2007 when we set the Record time at the Nuerburgring Nordschleife with a Zonda F, and we are developers with them regarding Pirelli PZero range of tires.
#138
02-27-2013, 01:10 PM
Top gear called pagani out :
Top Gear has responded and they are asking Pagani about their tires.
And pagani responded:
Yes, we have heard these rumors around our record lap at TopGear. We used Pirelli PZero Trofeo. As first equipment we offer to our customers three different types of tires, all of them omologated for street use: Pirelli PZero, Pirelli PZero Corsa and Pirelli Pzero Trofeo.
Pirelli PZero Trofeo can be treated as Michelin Pilot sport cup for example.
In comparison to the times we have done at other tracks, We can say that we are still faster than the time we scored. From our calculations we are even 1.5/2 seconds faster than what we have done.
Pirelli is our partner since 2007 when we set the Record time at the Nuerburgring Nordschleife with a Zonda F, and we are developers with them regarding Pirelli PZero range of tires.
Top Gear has responded and they are asking Pagani about their tires.
And pagani responded:
Yes, we have heard these rumors around our record lap at TopGear. We used Pirelli PZero Trofeo. As first equipment we offer to our customers three different types of tires, all of them omologated for street use: Pirelli PZero, Pirelli PZero Corsa and Pirelli Pzero Trofeo.
Pirelli PZero Trofeo can be treated as Michelin Pilot sport cup for example.
In comparison to the times we have done at other tracks, We can say that we are still faster than the time we scored. From our calculations we are even 1.5/2 seconds faster than what we have done.
Pirelli is our partner since 2007 when we set the Record time at the Nuerburgring Nordschleife with a Zonda F, and we are developers with them regarding Pirelli PZero range of tires.
As an aside. How can they even say they "are even 1.5/2 seconds faster than they scored"? Maybe they can take a shortcut through the grass, lol.
#140
02-27-2013, 01:17 PM
There is no need to be rude. I'm just forwarding the information I got.
And posing a question.. Being on a small screen with crap connection I'm not able to analyze the pictures.
But yes I also noticed the lack of wear bars.
Ps
Pagani has been asked about the sizing designations.. Answer is pending
And posing a question.. Being on a small screen with crap connection I'm not able to analyze the pictures.
But yes I also noticed the lack of wear bars.
Ps
Pagani has been asked about the sizing designations.. Answer is pending