If your opinion of a BS is that it is too heavy I would have to assume you've not driven one? Given you've not had a car that weighed more than 3000 pounds I wonder what they were/are? Perhaps it's all in what you get used to?

 

im not seeing a problem here?

less weight and the addition of turbos, sounds like a great recipe to me.

 

If the technology exists to make large displacement more fuel efficient motors then why is not a single manufacturer using it. I think legislation combined with media coverage (gas guzzling, non-green, forcing it down our throat, car companies....) has everything to do with why car manufacturers are moving to smaller high efficiency motors. Otherwise, why in the midst of horsepower wars would Audi and BMW suddenly decide to step back in time and put smaller more fuel efficient motors in their performance cars? Sorry but, I will never buy that they are doing it for the reasons stated/implied in this thread. No manufacturer "cares" that much about their base, especially the base from yester year.....

You're a BMW enthusiast who doesn't know about the V8 controversy in the race M3 from a few years ago? My guess is that is part of the reason there is a V8 in the M3 now?

 

Edit: "I concede that this opinion is informed by my lack of seat time in heavier cars"

Does that mean you're offering?

Weight is nearing 4,000 lbs., right?

I learned to drive on a BMW 528e (circa 1300 kg) and drove a miata and an S2000 during high school. For what it's worth a close friend had an E46 M3 and I probably put 500 miles on it myself. It felt way too heavy, even though I got to know the intimate tendencies of the chassis on some nice driving roads.

 

Sorry, I think you're stretching your hypothesis here.

I think cost is a major concern, and largely the reason we aren't seeing fuel efficient larger displacement performance motors. Still, you see stuff like Audi's terribly inefficient 340HP 4.2l V8 in the S4, and then the same motor in the RS4, with another 60HP get much better mileage because of some tweaks, mainly FSI technology. Or, the best performing factory car in the world (ZR1) getting 20+ MPG on the highway. Why couldn't companies extrapolate on this and create 500HP NA V8's that get 25+ MPG on the highway?

And no, I don't pay much attention to divisions outside of consumer cars. I didn't realize there was a set criteria that need be followed in order to be a qualified enthusiast.

 

I think there are more than a few tweeks involved in that motor to get it to 414hp from 340hp and to redlined at 8250rpm from the S4's 7000rpm redline. And yes direct fuel injection helped but that was only part of the story. And im sorry but using any of those big N/A engines the way they are designed to be used and you will not get the economy or the emissions control of a smaller turbocharged engine.
And lets not forget that a ZR1 can achieve 25+mpg on the hwy because its got a galactic 6th gear ratio which would be good for more than 300mph...thats why it sits at about 1700rpm at hwy speeds....

I for one like light weight high revving cars ( i own a Z4 ///MCoupe) and i never find my car under torqued... But driving our families chipped 997 turbo reminds me how insane an F/I engine can be. And i for one love the sound of a turbo'd straight Six, modified Supra or R34 anyone?

As ive said before and someone else stated, When i buy an ///M my number 1 concerns are a unique and incredible engine and great handling.
I just dont want a series production motor that has been tweaked.... Then there is no reason to go ///M because you can grab a regular 335i throw a limited slip, chip and coilovers and you've got 90% of the car for 60% of the price....
Lets just hope BWM ///M can give us a turbocharged straight six that redlines at 8000+, but produces monster torque in the low/midrange but with a shit ton of character...

 

You said it better than me. Rep!

 

Obviously smaller engines can be developed for these cars as a means of reducing fuel consumption or lowering emissions, and F/I goes a long way towards bringing the horsepower up to the level of much larger displacement engines, but the real key for the future of the automotive industry, as well as for the future of the automotive enthusiast should be in reducing the weight of the vehicles.

As far as maximizing acceleration is concerned, the idea would be to cram as much power into as lightweight of a chassis as possible. It's all about power to weight ratio. In the handling department, power plays a much smaller role compared to lightness in conjunction with stiffness. The key ingredient in manufacturing any sports car is lightness. Just look at Lotus; with the Elise, they have a high performance sports car that can meet all of the safety regulations and return 30+ mpg while decimating nearly everything on the race track.

How did Lotus achieve this massive accomplishment? By following in the footsteps of the late Colin Chapman who defined his sports cars by "adding lightness". Admittedly, it wouldn't make sense for BMW or any other sports/luxury brand to follow that philosophy to the letter, but if these manufacturers could take some of Chapman's ideas and apply them to all of their respective production vehicles, they may just create better cars.

 

i agree , bummer!

 

Yes, I realize that much of the motor was reworked, but my point stands: with proper investment and work, these motors can be higher performing, of larger displacement, and efficient.

If you drive any motor hard, you're not going to get the claimed MPG, or anywhere near. However, CAFE - or any other federal legislation - doesn't take driver tendencies into account, just what the car is capable of.

But we're sort of veering away from the point, which is that BMW's decision to take their Motorsport division a different direction isn't motivated all by federal emissions regulations - IMO. There is a ton of evidence and support that makes that hypothesis inconclusive, at best. My best bet is they see a niche, a market that has great potential, and they are looking to capitalize on it. I admit it's idyllic to think BMW is really interested in getting to their roots as they state, but I think we can all agree that if their marketing department didn't find solid evidence that this notion would sell to consumers, they wouldn't be stating it.