CGT Design Flaw??
Oct 5, 2009 | 12:52 PM
#41
Its only three o'clock....wtf
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 16,774
From: Massachusetts
The OP asks if there is a "design flaw" well I would say that yes there is....
Porsche have shown with the 997GT2 and the new 997GT3 that they can developeTC/PSM systems which really enhance the driving experience and which can be switched off in two stages should the driver want the full fat version, this IMO should have been on the CGT, that is the design flaw nothing else....
Porsche have shown with the 997GT2 and the new 997GT3 that they can developeTC/PSM systems which really enhance the driving experience and which can be switched off in two stages should the driver want the full fat version, this IMO should have been on the CGT, that is the design flaw nothing else....
Oct 5, 2009 | 12:52 PM
#42
Teamspeed Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 104
The OP asks if there is a "design flaw" well I would say that yes there is....
Porsche have shown with the 997GT2 and the new 997GT3 that they can developeTC/PSM systems which really enhance the driving experience and which can be switched off in two stages should the driver want the full fat version, this IMO should have been on the CGT, that is the design flaw nothing else....
Porsche have shown with the 997GT2 and the new 997GT3 that they can developeTC/PSM systems which really enhance the driving experience and which can be switched off in two stages should the driver want the full fat version, this IMO should have been on the CGT, that is the design flaw nothing else....
In my opinion the type of electronic intervention you mention just dilutes the driving pleasure by taking the effort and skill out of it.
Sure it's easier to drive quickly with less commitment or for those with less ability, but that removes the very essence of what the CGT represents.
There is no 'design flaw' with the CGT, it's just that it's demanding handling traits are not readily mastered without effort and commitment.
Next you'll be suggesting it should have been four wheel drive and automatic transmission
Oct 5, 2009 | 01:34 PM
#43
Teamspeed Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 307
Don't agree Toby.
In my opinion the type of electronic intervention you mention just dilutes the driving pleasure by taking the effort and skill out of it.
Sure it's easier to drive quickly with less commitment or for those with less ability, but that removes the very essence of what the CGT represents.
There is no 'design flaw' with the CGT, it's just that it's demanding handling traits are not readily mastered without effort and commitment.
Next you'll be suggesting it should have been four wheel drive and automatic transmission
In my opinion the type of electronic intervention you mention just dilutes the driving pleasure by taking the effort and skill out of it.
Sure it's easier to drive quickly with less commitment or for those with less ability, but that removes the very essence of what the CGT represents.
There is no 'design flaw' with the CGT, it's just that it's demanding handling traits are not readily mastered without effort and commitment.
Next you'll be suggesting it should have been four wheel drive and automatic transmission
Oct 5, 2009 | 01:38 PM
#44
Thread Starter
| Teamspeed Pro
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,067
From: StoryBook
I don't believe Porsche had PSM developed yet when the CGT was on the drawing boards. Thus the 02/03 GT2 did not have that option. I believe only after the problems associated with the 996 GT2 did Porsche go full force into development of the PSM system on their 911s. Not 100% positive, but seems the timeline makes sense.
Oct 5, 2009 | 02:53 PM
#47
Teamspeed Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 307
I don't believe Porsche had PSM developed yet when the CGT was on the drawing boards. Thus the 02/03 GT2 did not have that option. I believe only after the problems associated with the 996 GT2 did Porsche go full force into development of the PSM system on their 911s. Not 100% positive, but seems the timeline makes sense.
I am probably out of my depth here because I remember the excitement about the first 997GT3 having this latest TC/PSM which was significantly better than anything before since it allowed a high degree of "excitement" before the systems kicked in....
Last edited by TB993tt; Oct 5, 2009 at 02:56 PM.
Oct 5, 2009 | 04:46 PM
#48
Teamspeed Pro
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 7,647
From: Munich,Germany
the Carrera GT is nothing else than a street legal race car that derived of a 24h LeMans prototype...engine,chassis components and some technical features were simply transferred to the CGT
it does not have too much in common with the regular development evolution of the 911 series
so why should it be a flaw to only have a simple TC if it was never even meant to be a nice shiny Porsche for city driving and spirited weekend drives for the regular driver...
You could search for some quotes of Walther Röhrl about that car,use Google translate and see for yourself
it does not have too much in common with the regular development evolution of the 911 series
so why should it be a flaw to only have a simple TC if it was never even meant to be a nice shiny Porsche for city driving and spirited weekend drives for the regular driver...
You could search for some quotes of Walther Röhrl about that car,use Google translate and see for yourself
Last edited by ECB; Oct 5, 2009 at 04:49 PM.
Oct 5, 2009 | 05:37 PM
#49
Board Certified Car Fanatic
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,825
After 3 years and almost 15,000 miles in my CGT it still requires my undivided attention 100% of the time when pushing the car on the road or track.
I had a great drive on Saturday, I drove from home 150 miles to Goodwood circuit on the South Coast for a trackday and then the 150 miles home totalling just under 500 miles.
I am firmly of the opinion it offers the most visceral and demanding driving experience of any Porsche street car, and is also the one that requires the most respect.
The TC system is at best rudimentary, and will allow high levels of slip angle before intervening. On the street I drive with it on, however on my journey to Goodwood on a damp section I still had half a turn of opposite lock at one point before the TC light came on. On the track I'd always switch the TC off unless it was wet or I was at the 'ring. The main issue on track with the TC is it hampers the point and level of power you can apply after the apex.
The Carrera GT is a car that to extract any measure of it's real performance requires a fair degree of skill and aptitude. Porsche could have 'dummed down' the experience with the addition of other electronic intervention devices but for me that would just have 'dummed down' the experience of mastering driving and controlling the car at pace on the road and track.
I for one applaud Porsche for making such a focused and undiluted drivers car, I'd never part with mine (well only to replace with another one!)
I doubt it's like will ever be repeated, let's not blame the car for some drivers inability for keeping it on the black stuff
I had a great drive on Saturday, I drove from home 150 miles to Goodwood circuit on the South Coast for a trackday and then the 150 miles home totalling just under 500 miles.
I am firmly of the opinion it offers the most visceral and demanding driving experience of any Porsche street car, and is also the one that requires the most respect.
The TC system is at best rudimentary, and will allow high levels of slip angle before intervening. On the street I drive with it on, however on my journey to Goodwood on a damp section I still had half a turn of opposite lock at one point before the TC light came on. On the track I'd always switch the TC off unless it was wet or I was at the 'ring. The main issue on track with the TC is it hampers the point and level of power you can apply after the apex.
The Carrera GT is a car that to extract any measure of it's real performance requires a fair degree of skill and aptitude. Porsche could have 'dummed down' the experience with the addition of other electronic intervention devices but for me that would just have 'dummed down' the experience of mastering driving and controlling the car at pace on the road and track.
I for one applaud Porsche for making such a focused and undiluted drivers car, I'd never part with mine (well only to replace with another one!)
I doubt it's like will ever be repeated, let's not blame the car for some drivers inability for keeping it on the black stuff
Great post John, spot on !
