Wow! Those are fully fledged race tires with an intermediate profile! They are certainly NOT street tires, lol!

Here are the F1 versions. The intermediate coded in green and the wet in blue.



And it's hysterical to see the Pagani shill claim the tires would scrub off a maximum 1.5 seconds when you have clear examples on the previous page of tires with much smaller differences between them scrubbing off a MINIMUM of two seconds. The Zonda R did it in 1.08.5 while the Zonda F did it in 1.18.4 and ultimately it's the tires that keeps the cars on the road. If the car was lapped on those tires it was nothing short of CHEATING.

Great detective work, mattjs!

 

Huayra is a great car but it came in a very bad time the time of the hybird supercars (918,p1,enzo). And great work guys for letting us know the truth about the tires

 

Elhimiel, as per usual you have jumped to conclusions without having the facts. Look at all these tyres below and tell me if you think they are street legal or not. The first one may look familiar to you:





|http://thumbsnap.com/NGqRJpm6[/img]

Just to put you out of your misery they are all street legal tyres in the UK, with most also being DOT approved for use on street cars in the USA. I am not sure about the legal requirements in Saudi but in the UK these tyres are legal and very popular. If you want model numbers I can also provide those if these do not convince you

I hope this clears things up for you

 

It clears up nothing actually, since none of them are Pirelli tires, making them irrelevant to the conversation.

Taking a look at the one photo that is a Pirelli tire (which I've retained in the quote above) -- it does appear to have a tread pattern very close to what is seen on the Huayra in the Stig photos. However, as best I can determine, this model tire dates back to 2009 (which we can thus conclude was not developed specifically for the Huayra as Pagani states), and does not match anything in the current PZero Corsa range (per Pirelli's website).

For the sake of argument, let's say the Power Lap tires are in fact the Huayra's special, never-before-seen PZero Corsa tires. Why would Pirelli using racing tire size designation on this one particular tire, when it and every other tire company all over the world uses aspect ratio size designation for all of their road legal tires, even those designed primarily for competition use (i.e. Hoosier R-series autocross tires)?

You take Elhimiel to task for not having facts. Here are some:

1. The Huayra wore tires for the Power Lap that it has never before been photographed wearing.
2. According to Pagani, the Huayra uses specific Pirelli PZero Corsa tires, sized 255/35ZR19 on the front.
3. The Power Lap front tire carries a size designation of 265/645-19.
4. This is racing tire size nomenclature, and explanation of which you can find on Pirelli's website.
5. The Power Lap tires do not say PZero anywhere on them.

Again, if you have any explanations for the above, I would entertain dicussion.

 

"Put you out of your misery..."

Those are all racing semi-slicks, mr Pagani shill! If some of them are street legal in some places it doesn't make them any less race tires, lol! Do you think you can drive those in day to day driving conditions?!?!

And as per usual the Pagani shill also likes to pick his facts! Why for instance pick the Federal FZ 201 as an example? Because the much more closely related Federal 595 RS-RACING would not promote the "truthiness" as well!




Now those bottom Federal 595 RS-RACING are a much more accurate profile wouldn't you all say? Smile for the camera and give us a thumbs up.

And this is of course without disregarding the fact that FZ 201 are also race tires.

Sepang 1000KM: Background info | Ignition.My

I hope this clears things up for you, mr Pagani shill! You can call the HQ and ask for a break because your work here is DONE!

 

Ok Matt I will see what I can do.

The tread pattern in the above photo is exactly the same as the one on the Huayra; the only difference is the width of the tyre.

The only real question is this: Is the tyre street legal? The only answer is absolutely "YES" It is sold as a street legal tyre to people who like to do track days on occasions. Is it the sort of tyre you would want on your car if you had to drive up a snowy hill or you lived in the Alps then probably no. But that does not take away from the fact the tyre was designed to be used "Legally" on the street.

The same applies to all the other tyres I mentioned above, I see them all the time on street cars here.

As for the tyres on the Huayra test car I would not be surprised if they were a custom sizing specific to that car, Bugatti lets not forget have totally custom tyres on the Veyron. Should their performance figures and top speed record runs be dismissed in the same way by you guys just because no one else can use or buy a similar tyre? I suspect not.

As I said before unless you now implement a control tyre only policy at the top gear track then all the manufactures are going to do their best to present a car capable of performing at its best. Just because you don’t like the look of a tyre does not make it illegal or a race tyre. If it has passed the very strict testing that all street tyres have to in this country then it is legal, end of story. The Huayra tyre is just a larger version of the tyre pictured above. If you don’t like that or is does not fit your agenda elhimiel then all I can say is sorry.

As for pointing to a race series that uses one of the above tyres to illustrate you point, what a complete waste of time. The UK has a huge number of race series currently running, the vast majority use a street legal tyre like the one you mentioned as a control tyre. That way all the cars are equal and and no one can "Buy" an advantage by using a race tyre. Ask anyone involved in club racing and they will tell you the same thing Elhimiel

Maybe you should give Pagani a call and ask them to re run the test on Elhimiel only approved tyre. I suspect even then you would argue over the result

 

Haha, what?? "The only real question"???

No, no, no. What you said was they were "Corsa type street tyre" and that you've seen this with your own eyes. They are clearly NOT "Corsa type street tyre", they are semi-slicks. If you knew the difference you chose not to tell the truth. If you didn't know the difference you were not being honest about your knowledge.

Then you said they are popular street tires in the UK. Driving them in the wet would be like driving on ice and the UK have been known to have one or two wet days each year. You either didn't tell the truth about the tires popularity in street use and "modified" the truth, or you again weren't being honest about your knowledge.

The rest is all semantics and you trying to WIGGLE YOUR WAY OUT of the fact that Pagani drove the car on semi-slicks instead of the full thread pattern. You are trying to make us believe that our EYES are lying to us and that these two patterns makes very little difference.




Now if that is the case then why don't F1 scrap all tires except the wet? Or why don't they drive the intermediate in the wet? Or why did they cut grooves in the slicks when they were trying to regulate cornering speed? They are all the same performance more or less, according to you? Slicks, semi-slicks and wets all perform equally well in the wet, damp and dry in mr Pagani shills book of "truthiness"?



No, it is NOT our EYES that are lying to us, mr Pagani shill. It is YOU. The car was NOT running a full thread pattern and it WAS running a intermediate semi-slick RACE tire. During this whole conversation on tires YOU KNEW it ran on a different pattern and you chose NOT TO DISCLOSE THE TRUTH. Then when this CHEATING came to light you chose another angle for your LIES. Pagani doesn't need ME to approve the tire when anyone with half a brain can tell that neither YOU OR THEM are being HONEST.

 

The only basis of comparison we have between the two is the pattern of the grooves at the outer edge, which is all of the tread we can see of the Power Lap tires, in the photo taken with the man inflating the tire (why is the tire flat? Are race tires more susceptible to punctures?)

How do we know this? Can you tell me what model tire they are? Or do they merely look similar on the outer shoulder to a tire that would be street legal?

This could very well be true also. But why are the Power Lap tires clearly not the size that Pagani tells us the Huayra uses? Why was it necessary for the Huayra to wear different tires for the purposes of the Power Lap?

I have no problem with the appearance of said tires, as long as the tires in use for the Power Lap are representative of road car configurations available for public purchase and use. Which is the whole point of the Power Lap in the first place, isn't it? What would be the easiest way to drop a few seconds off a lap time, in any competitive format you chose?

Let's consider the nearly three second gap in times between the MP4-12C and the Huayra. The 12C gives up 100 horsepower to the Huayra, while weighing nearly the same (keep in mind the 12C topped the Super Sport, despite having 400 less horsepower, although I concede the Bug is 1000 pounds heavier). I don't see the active aero contributing too much to the lap time on the Top Gear track, with it's slow corners. Three seconds is a lot to attribute to just a little more power, and handling and braking prowess, on a course that short.

 

So Streetrod, I was considering your thesis that the Huayra Power Lap tires were indeed street legal tires that we haven't seen before. I went back over several images attached to this thread quite thoroughly. It gave me an idea.

Go ahead and Google images for "Zonda R slick". You will find a photo of the Zonda R's magnificent Pirelli racing slick. I have attached it below.

Notice the little dots in the tread. These are used as wear indicators for treadless racing tires, to determine the level of wear they have experienced.

So I have one more question I would like you consider: Why would a treaded, street legal tire need wear indicator dots?

 

First of all what the hell is Mr Pagani SHILL? haha

And secondly..

Did Pagani claim it was driven on a specific tire during the record?
Or did Top gear state any rules towards what tires you can use?

If the answer is no on both questions..

then just lay off the discussion, as there is no foul play.

Everyone knows that the Top Gear lap times are non scientific.

Different days,different drivers..different setups..
Its not like a super serious 1 day 1 driver event of lap times.