Got my mk2 GT3, sold the GTR still have the E92 M3 and Evo 9 MR. Here's my take.
#21
01-28-2010, 06:35 PM
Thanks for the write-up. I'm certain a GT3 is my next car.
And thanks for giving the Evo the props it deserves. I loved my Evo til the day it died...
And thanks for giving the Evo the props it deserves. I loved my Evo til the day it died...
#23
01-28-2010, 09:55 PM
The pricing was finally right so I picked up my 2010 GT3 from Schneider Nelson in Jersey. Ed is the man by the way. White with sport buckets, dynamic engine mounts and nav, sound chrno. Given I just sold my GTR I'd give my brief review with pros and cons of all my toys.
Yes the GTR is faster. I don't care what anyone says. I immediately found out when I took my first drive off the lot in the GT3. I stalled. hehe. That clutch is heavy
. All kidding aside, in the GT3 I had the sense that I was in a go kart. Not just in handling but aware that the engine was in the back, rear wheel drive and no weight in the front. For those who go kart, it's that immediate sense that you want to go fast to catch the guy in front but know that you'll spin out if you mash the gas in a turn. So every action I take is premeditated. Especially downshifting, entering a turn, etc. It's basicly what makes the GT3 so much fun.
In the GTR I could be drinking a latte while on the phone (hands free of course) and be able to just do the triple click from 6th to 3rd and just floor it. I'll feel like Neo where every other car is at a standstill and I just zig zag my way through. Which is fun in it's own way but can get you into trouble.
Given the GTR's setup, I know that I simply cannot shift faster than it so stop light drags are pointless. Around a racetrack or twisty road, the GTR just feels very safe. No white knuckle driving, it just turns and goes. The only fear is not running wide but running into the guy in front of you.
That's where the GTR's benefits end. The car is HUGE and the ride is harsh with a bite that it made me feel bad for my passengers. The GT3 is sublime. It feels alive. That sport button is insane. It's a true sports car in the sense that it's the best street legal GT race car you can buy.
Is the GT3 a daily driver? With the regular seats, maybe. The buckets, no. Getting in and out can be a pain when you slam your thigh into sidewall of the rigid bucket seat. The ride is perfect for a sports car though. Stiff but not harsh and definately no bite. The softer regular seats will add enough cushion to be able to drive in NYC.
The car is SUPER low so yeah, I wish I had the lift. Dealership experience was outstanding. I left feeling like the time I purchased my first Rolex. It was a nice feeling
Ok here are my preferences. If not listed, They stay home.
Tight Twisty two lane Road:
Evo. No other.
Twisty road:
1st: GT3
2nd: Evo
3rd: GTR
Wide open road:
Tie GTR GT3
Race track for laptimes and bullying:
GTR
Race track for fun:
1st: GT3,
2nd:M3
Going out to the city with friends:
M3 Chicks just love this car.
Snow/Rain/Ski trips:
Evo, Evo Evo!
Steering handling shifting
1st: GT3
2nd: Evo. A very close second
Tie: GTR's steering and handling better but I can shift the M3.
Yes the GTR is faster. I don't care what anyone says. I immediately found out when I took my first drive off the lot in the GT3. I stalled. hehe. That clutch is heavy
. All kidding aside, in the GT3 I had the sense that I was in a go kart. Not just in handling but aware that the engine was in the back, rear wheel drive and no weight in the front. For those who go kart, it's that immediate sense that you want to go fast to catch the guy in front but know that you'll spin out if you mash the gas in a turn. So every action I take is premeditated. Especially downshifting, entering a turn, etc. It's basicly what makes the GT3 so much fun. In the GTR I could be drinking a latte while on the phone (hands free of course) and be able to just do the triple click from 6th to 3rd and just floor it. I'll feel like Neo where every other car is at a standstill and I just zig zag my way through. Which is fun in it's own way but can get you into trouble.
Given the GTR's setup, I know that I simply cannot shift faster than it so stop light drags are pointless. Around a racetrack or twisty road, the GTR just feels very safe. No white knuckle driving, it just turns and goes. The only fear is not running wide but running into the guy in front of you.
That's where the GTR's benefits end. The car is HUGE and the ride is harsh with a bite that it made me feel bad for my passengers. The GT3 is sublime. It feels alive. That sport button is insane. It's a true sports car in the sense that it's the best street legal GT race car you can buy.
Is the GT3 a daily driver? With the regular seats, maybe. The buckets, no. Getting in and out can be a pain when you slam your thigh into sidewall of the rigid bucket seat. The ride is perfect for a sports car though. Stiff but not harsh and definately no bite. The softer regular seats will add enough cushion to be able to drive in NYC.
The car is SUPER low so yeah, I wish I had the lift. Dealership experience was outstanding. I left feeling like the time I purchased my first Rolex. It was a nice feeling
Ok here are my preferences. If not listed, They stay home.
Tight Twisty two lane Road:
Evo. No other.
Twisty road:
1st: GT3
2nd: Evo
3rd: GTR
Wide open road:
Tie GTR GT3
Race track for laptimes and bullying:
GTR
Race track for fun:
1st: GT3,
2nd:M3
Going out to the city with friends:
M3 Chicks just love this car.
Snow/Rain/Ski trips:
Evo, Evo Evo!
Steering handling shifting
1st: GT3
2nd: Evo. A very close second
Tie: GTR's steering and handling better but I can shift the M3.
I still have lots of respect for the gtr it was more suited to attacking long sweeping corners with decreasing raduis where you can power through the whole turn where as in the gt3 you have to wait until near exit then rotate the car on power which is amazing.The gtr does not let you rotate it like the gt3,there is slight understeer near the limit.iv managed to slide my back end twice in that car which was also fun and in a controlled fashion.
Also correct me if im wrong but i thing the gtr engine is smoother,in the gt3 after 4000-4500rpm it seems like the turbos have kicked in.Also from about 160km/h - 240km/h the gt3 actually feels faster it just keeps pulling.i wish they had put shorter gearing,i like to open the windows and enjoy the amazing sound this engine makes but after 3rd youre going way to fast and the wind starts to kill your ear drums.the sound is very addicting.
The rear enginer balance you mentioned is absolutely felt the first time you drive this car,but where other cars(front engine) start to understeer on power this oversteers,its almost a totally opposite way of driving a car fast through a bend.learning to take advantage of the balance is very challenging but fun compared to any other car on the planet i would say.ok so i havent driven them all but it feels so different.also if you go too fast into a corner(with factory alignment) the car just goes into safe understeer(im not a pro driver but this is from my experience which is only few days of ownership so i might be wrong).
lastly gtr was fun only when you went near its limits,ie you need to drive the car very fast in order to enjoy the masses of grip and power.also as a dd i would the gtr if only because of the stiff gt3 clutch in traffic.both cars are amazing imho and not boring as some have put it.oh and the sound system sux on the porsche hehe.
btw ive never driven an evo,how do you compare the ride quality to gtr or gt3?also shifting in the gt3 will get better once you put some miles on it,especially 3rd which is very notchy at first.
#24
01-28-2010, 10:31 PM
fun2k, we're pretty much on the same page. Your description of taking a turn in the GT3 vs the GTR is spot on. The GT3 can feel faster mainly because there is no lag. It pulls but the GTR felt faster for me because of the increasing sense of thrust which is why boost is great. The pull on the GT3 however is immediate so the car feels quick when you jab the throttle when on the highway. There is a slight lag in the GTR, slight but still there.
I also had to really being moving in the GTR to have fun as well. The Evo is fun doing 40 in a 20mph winding road. The GTR couldn't do that because it was just too big. You need some really big sweeping roads or a racetrack to have fun.
I have the sound package plus which is a joke. I had to double check the sticker to see that it was on there. I can't even imagine what regular sound package is like.
The Evo is fun but and it's a big BUT. It's old. It's dark and gloomy inside especially at night. No bright colorful LCD Nav, interior lighting or anything. The ride is nicer than both the GTR and GT3. I have the MR which has the more compliant bilsteins. It's a thrilling ride and so much fun because of nothing between you and the road. Similar to why the old M3 and 1st gen GTi were so great. But you can't do that with new cars now. People need heft and a sense of weight with everything and associate that with quality. Unfortunately it takes away from the driving experience imho
I also had to really being moving in the GTR to have fun as well. The Evo is fun doing 40 in a 20mph winding road. The GTR couldn't do that because it was just too big. You need some really big sweeping roads or a racetrack to have fun.
I have the sound package plus which is a joke. I had to double check the sticker to see that it was on there. I can't even imagine what regular sound package is like.
The Evo is fun but and it's a big BUT. It's old
. It's dark and gloomy inside especially at night. No bright colorful LCD Nav, interior lighting or anything. The ride is nicer than both the GTR and GT3. I have the MR which has the more compliant bilsteins. It's a thrilling ride and so much fun because of nothing between you and the road. Similar to why the old M3 and 1st gen GTi were so great. But you can't do that with new cars now. People need heft and a sense of weight with everything and associate that with quality. Unfortunately it takes away from the driving experience imho
#25
01-29-2010, 01:30 AM
fun2k, we're pretty much on the same page. Your description of taking a turn in the GT3 vs the GTR is spot on. The GT3 can feel faster mainly because there is no lag. It pulls but the GTR felt faster for me because of the increasing sense of thrust which is why boost is great. The pull on the GT3 however is immediate so the car feels quick when you jab the throttle when on the highway. There is a slight lag in the GTR, slight but still there.
I also had to really being moving in the GTR to have fun as well. The Evo is fun doing 40 in a 20mph winding road. The GTR couldn't do that because it was just too big. You need some really big sweeping roads or a racetrack to have fun.
I have the sound package plus which is a joke. I had to double check the sticker to see that it was on there. I can't even imagine what regular sound package is like.
The Evo is fun but and it's a big BUT. It's old. It's dark and gloomy inside especially at night. No bright colorful LCD Nav, interior lighting or anything. The ride is nicer than both the GTR and GT3. I have the MR which has the more compliant bilsteins. It's a thrilling ride and so much fun because of nothing between you and the road. Similar to why the old M3 and 1st gen GTi were so great. But you can't do that with new cars now. People need heft and a sense of weight with everything and associate that with quality. Unfortunately it takes away from the driving experience imho
I also had to really being moving in the GTR to have fun as well. The Evo is fun doing 40 in a 20mph winding road. The GTR couldn't do that because it was just too big. You need some really big sweeping roads or a racetrack to have fun.
I have the sound package plus which is a joke. I had to double check the sticker to see that it was on there. I can't even imagine what regular sound package is like.
The Evo is fun but and it's a big BUT. It's old
. It's dark and gloomy inside especially at night. No bright colorful LCD Nav, interior lighting or anything. The ride is nicer than both the GTR and GT3. I have the MR which has the more compliant bilsteins. It's a thrilling ride and so much fun because of nothing between you and the road. Similar to why the old M3 and 1st gen GTi were so great. But you can't do that with new cars now. People need heft and a sense of weight with everything and associate that with quality. Unfortunately it takes away from the driving experience imhoIn a turbo car there will alway be lag betweem applying the throttle and getting the turbos to spool up.between 135i,997tt and gtr,gtr had the least lag.
Gtr did feel heavy sometimes , it sort of feels reluctant to quick direction changes after a fast corner where as the gt3 just loves to change direction on throttle.
Thanks for the input on the evo,i know about the interior it feels like a normal lancer inside.i cross shopped the evo x when i got my 135.The interior,the bucket seats,size and weight(more turbo lag?) made me look else where.I actually prefer the 9 to x. ive heard there very easy to power slide=big fun.
The gt3 needs some commitment to go fast(balls!),when i first got the car i was much slower in the corners than my 135.After getting to know the car im a little bit faster.Still, taking the same corner at the same speed as the bmw,it feels more envolving in the gt3,i know gt3 can go much quicker but you need to learn the balance of the car and when to apply throttle.
#26
01-29-2010, 06:23 AM
I ordered my 7.2GT3 in Nov and sold my GTR in Dec and I still have my 6GT3 with me. I concur with your assessment on GTR. My take for GTR is it's good for a one or two lap time attack and it'll overheat if you don't ease off after that. GTR is definitely faster than a GT3 up to 200kmh, on par from 200-250kmh and could be a little slower than a GT3 from 250-300kmh.
I find GTR too big and heavy for track and winding roads and too harsh for a highway cruiser and hence I decided to sell it. It's fast but not as fun as a GT3. Now going through a long painful wait for new GT3.....
I find GTR too big and heavy for track and winding roads and too harsh for a highway cruiser and hence I decided to sell it. It's fast but not as fun as a GT3. Now going through a long painful wait for new GT3.....
