Need Some Recommendations
Oct 16, 2009 | 11:56 PM
#1
Thread Starter
| Teamspeed Senior Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 698
From: Middle GA, US
Need Some Recommendations
I want to get a good hunting rifle, no game bigger than a deer. I don't really know what is good or what caliber to get, so I ask you guys. Can't cost too much either. Any suggestions or advice is greatly appreciated.
Oct 17, 2009 | 12:15 AM
#2
Official TS Crybaby - Forever
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,861
From: the death star
17 HMR
I kid you not, I was in big5 sporting goods the other day and a dude looking at rifles said he downed a few deer with one.
Do you want open sights or scoped? Scopes will add a lot to the price point. I recently shot some ww1/2 era rifles that sell for cheap and are super accurate, easy to buy bulk cheap ammo aswell. Check this crazy shit out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZ-Lcvyrifw
I kid you not, I was in big5 sporting goods the other day and a dude looking at rifles said he downed a few deer with one.
Do you want open sights or scoped? Scopes will add a lot to the price point. I recently shot some ww1/2 era rifles that sell for cheap and are super accurate, easy to buy bulk cheap ammo aswell. Check this crazy shit out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZ-Lcvyrifw
Oct 17, 2009 | 12:35 AM
#3
Teamspeed Pro
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,466
From: NY
.270 or .308 are both great deer rounds. .308 is more versatile, 30-06 has a little more punch. Anything bigger is a waste, unless you plan on hunting mule deer or trophy white tail, in which case you could use a .300, but I have shot mule deer with a .308 and never had a problem. I haven't shopped for a rifle in a long time, but a remington 700 always is a good choice, but don't forget to save some money for optics.
Last edited by JarodL; Oct 17, 2009 at 12:38 AM.
Oct 17, 2009 | 12:48 AM
#4
Teamspeed Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 983
From: Pacific Northwest
I like the Remington model 700 in a .308... You can purchase one almost anywhere, there are several configurations to choose from, and endless available accessories. It's the type of rifle that you could build for almost any application (IMO) ~ and accurate as hell
Caliber: .223 Rem (5.56x45mm) and .308 Win (7.62x51mm, 7.62mm NATO)
Operation: Bolt Action, rotating bolt with 2 lugs
Weight: 4.08kg empty without telescope
Length: 1662mm
Barrel: 660mm. (other lenghts available)
Feed: 4-Round internal magazine (detachable magazine in model 700 Police DM in .308 Win)
Stock: HS Precision
Sights: variable telescopic
Max Effective Range: 800 meters
Expected Accuracy: Less than 1 MOA with M118 (Ammo is limiting factor)
Basically, Remington model 700 Police is simply re-stocked Remington model 700 VS (Varmint Synthetic). Remington manufactured its famous model 700 since 1962. This rifle is perhaps one most widely used across the USA as a bolt-action tactical rifle. This rifle traces its ancestry back to the British P14/US model 1917 Enfield. Starting with model 700BDL action, Remington adds a stainless-steel barrel and a carbon-fiber stock, then tunes the rifle for one-minute-of-angle accuracy using match grade ammo. This rifle design was (and is) a basis for many custom build tactical sniper rifles. The USMC (Marine Corps) was among the first to make model 700 action the basis for a precision sniper rifle. The original USMC M40 bolt-action sniper rifle used in Vietnam and into the late 1970s was built on a Remington Model 700BDL action. In fact, today's M40A1s are still being rebuilt on these same actions. Lather, when the US Army decided to switch from a semi-automatic to a bolt-action rifle, the Remington Model 700 action was chosen for the M24.
Technically, all model 700 rifles have carbon or satinless steel tubular receivers of greater strenght. The rotating bolt locks with two lugs that located at the front of the bolt, into recesses made in the receiver walls. The trigger is crisp. Remington not only manufactured the rifles - it also sell the actions (with or without barrels) to many manufacturers of the custom rifles. So, it is common to see Remington 700 action in HS Precision, McMillan or Choate stock with custom target barrel and other options. For another example, famous UK based company, Accuracy International, manufactured it's own tactical chassis for Rem 700 - AICS stage I or II.
Operation: Bolt Action, rotating bolt with 2 lugs
Weight: 4.08kg empty without telescope
Length: 1662mm
Barrel: 660mm. (other lenghts available)
Feed: 4-Round internal magazine (detachable magazine in model 700 Police DM in .308 Win)
Stock: HS Precision
Sights: variable telescopic
Max Effective Range: 800 meters
Expected Accuracy: Less than 1 MOA with M118 (Ammo is limiting factor)
Basically, Remington model 700 Police is simply re-stocked Remington model 700 VS (Varmint Synthetic). Remington manufactured its famous model 700 since 1962. This rifle is perhaps one most widely used across the USA as a bolt-action tactical rifle. This rifle traces its ancestry back to the British P14/US model 1917 Enfield. Starting with model 700BDL action, Remington adds a stainless-steel barrel and a carbon-fiber stock, then tunes the rifle for one-minute-of-angle accuracy using match grade ammo. This rifle design was (and is) a basis for many custom build tactical sniper rifles. The USMC (Marine Corps) was among the first to make model 700 action the basis for a precision sniper rifle. The original USMC M40 bolt-action sniper rifle used in Vietnam and into the late 1970s was built on a Remington Model 700BDL action. In fact, today's M40A1s are still being rebuilt on these same actions. Lather, when the US Army decided to switch from a semi-automatic to a bolt-action rifle, the Remington Model 700 action was chosen for the M24.
Technically, all model 700 rifles have carbon or satinless steel tubular receivers of greater strenght. The rotating bolt locks with two lugs that located at the front of the bolt, into recesses made in the receiver walls. The trigger is crisp. Remington not only manufactured the rifles - it also sell the actions (with or without barrels) to many manufacturers of the custom rifles. So, it is common to see Remington 700 action in HS Precision, McMillan or Choate stock with custom target barrel and other options. For another example, famous UK based company, Accuracy International, manufactured it's own tactical chassis for Rem 700 - AICS stage I or II.
The Remington Model 700 series is the all-time best selling line of bolt action sporting rifles in the world. They were an immediate hit when introduced in 1962 and have never looked back. The Model 700 has also become the favored action of many custom rifle builders.
The Model 700 action was designed for ease of manufacture, given the manufacturing technology of the early 1960's, and uses a round action machined from bar stock, a plunger ejector in the bolt face and a sort of circlip in the bolt face that snaps over the rim of a chambered cartridge to extract the fired brass. The bolt face is recessed to enclose the base of the cartridge, which is also surrounded by the chamber end of the barrel and the front receiver ring. The cartridge head is thus circled by three rings of steel, much as with the Weatherby Mark V action, and this fact was not overlooked by the Remington advertising department.
Traditionalists considered these cost cutting innovations "cheap," but the customers responded in droves to the undeniable good looks of the Model 700 ADL and BDL rifles themselves. They were among the best looking hunting rifles ever introduced and the stock design handled recoil very well, which made them pleasant to shoot. The two position safety (back for "safe" and forward for "fire") at the rear of the action is easy to operate; it used to lock the bolt (to prevent inadvertent opening in the field) as well as the trigger, but the former feature has been eliminated. They were also hell for strong and very accurate. An excellent user-adjustable trigger with the exceptionally fast lock time of 3.0 milliseconds complemented the inherent accuracy of the new rifles.
Remington got a leg up on the market because in 1964 Winchester introduced a revised version of their famous Model 70 rifle--really a new action--also designed for easier manufacture, that pleased practically no one. The new Model 70 was actually a good action, but the stock design, barrel bedding, checkering, and so forth left a lot to be desired. Many previous Winchester customers turned to the sharp looking Model 700 from Remington.
The Model 700 has evolved with the market place and today it is available in a bewildering array of models. Some are pretty plain and some are bespoke rifles turned out to special order in Remington's Custom Gun Shop. Model 700 barreled actions are made from carbon or stainless steel, with matte or polished finishes, and stocked in solid walnut, laminated wood, and synthetic materials. They come in a variety of barrel lengths and contours and for a wide range of cartridges. The constant (at least for the centerfire rifles) is the Model 700 action itself, the heart of every Model 700 rifle.
I have been involved with Model 700 rifles since 1965 and I have lost track of all of the permutations over the years. In 2008 alone the Remington catalog lists some 21 variations of Model 700's, excluding Custom Shop offerings.
It is impossible to chronicle so many models in one article, so I will attempt to describe only a few of the best known and most interesting Model 700 variations. For 2008, the top of the Model 700 line is the CDL (blued barreled action and walnut stock) and CDL SF (stainless/fluted barreled action and walnut stock). CDL models come standard with a hinged magazine floorplate (the release button is inside the front of the trigger guard). The classic style, straight comb stocks are laser cut checkered in a generous pattern and supplied with studs for detachable sling swivels. Both the barreled action and the stock of all CDL models wears a non-glare satin finish. We have reviewed the 2008 Limited Edition version of the Model 700 CDL SF in .260 caliber, so for further details about this model I will simply refer you to the Product review Page.
The Model 700 BDL (which I translate as "B-grade Deluxe") was the flagship of the Model 700 line from its inception until the introduction of the CDL in 2005. BDL models come standard with a hinged magazine floorplate (the release button is inside the front of the trigger guard) or a detachable box magazine ("DM" versions). Stocks are checkered and supplied with studs for detachable sling swivels. Left handed BDL's are available.
The traditional BDL comes with a genuine walnut Monte Carlo style stock which is cut checkered in an attractive skip-line point pattern that wraps around the fore-end. This stock is fitted with a black fore-end tip, pistol grip cap, and black butt plate or recoil pad (in magnum calibers), all set off by white line spacers. The barreled action receives Remington's polished blue finish. An adjustable open rear and hooded ramp front sight are standard. This is Remington's most attractive regular production rifle.
Over the years, the walnut stocked BDL has been available in more calibers than any other Model 700 variation. in 2005 the list included .17 Rem., .222 Rem., .223 Rem., .22-250 Rem., .243 Win., .25-06 Rem., .270 Win., 7mm-08 Rem., .280 Rem., 7mm Rem. Mag., 7mm Ultra Mag, .308 Win., .30-06 Spfd., .300 Win. Mag., .300 Ultra Mag, .338 Win. Mag., .338 Ultra Mag and .375 Ultra Mag, but by 2008 the list had been significently reduced in favor of the newer Model 700 CDL.
There is also a Synthetic Stainless BDL. This version features a matte black synthetic stock with a recoil pad and a satin (silver) stainless steel barreled action without sights. The BDL Synthetic Stainless is a handsome example of a rifle of its type. It is available in calibers .270 Win., 7mm Rem. SAUM, 7mm Rem. Mag., 7mm Ultra Mag, .30-06 Spfd., .300 Rem. SAUM, .300 Win. Mag., .300 Ultra Mag, .338 Win. Mag., .338 Ultra Mag, .375 H&H Mag. and .375 Ultra Mag.
Special long range Model 700's include the Sendero SF and Varmint rifles. The Sendero SF is an ultra-long range big game rifle that features a fluted, stainless steel, heavy barreled action in a special, un-checkered, aramid-fiber-reinforced stock with full length aluminum bedding blocks. Calibers are limited to the various 7mm and .300 Magnums, plus the .338 Ultra Mag.
The three Model 700 Varmint rifles are the 700 VS, a heavy barreled varmint rifle with a fiberglass composite stock; the 700 VLS, a heavy barrel varmint rifle in a laminated wood Monte Carlo style stock; and the 700 VS SF, with a heavy, fluted, stainless steel barreled action in a fiberglass composite stock. None of these stocks are checkered. Calibers include .220 Swift, .223 Rem., .22-250 Rem. and .308 Win. The latter, of course, is not a varmint caliber at all.
An oddity is the Ultimate Lightweight Model 700 Titanium. This features a titanium action mated to a 22" lightweight stainless steel barrel, a fluted bolt, and a very plain, un-checkered, carbon-fiber composite stock. It weighs only 5 1/4 pounds in short action calibers .260 Rem., 7mm-08 Rem. and .308 Win. or 5 1/2 pounds in long action calibers .270 Win. and .30-06 Spfd. Maybe they should have named it the Ultimate Kick Model 700 Titanium!
One of the neatest Model 700's is the Mountain Rifle LSS. The Mountain Rifle LSS is a deluxe model that features a stainless steel barreled action with a slim profile 22" barrel and a slender, modern classic style, laminated hardwood stock. It is what Remington refers to as a "Specialty" rifle. Remington literature says that the Model 700 Mountain Rifle is designed for wilderness or high country pack-in hunts that involve rigorous hiking.
In the Remington world, "LSS" signifies a rifle with laminated wood stock and stainless steel metal parts. The internal magazine has a hinged floorplate with a trigger guard mounted release. The stock is stained a medium walnut brown color. The barreled action is made from satin finished 416 stainless steel. It is a good looking rifle that stops just this side of being gaudy--a line that other stainless/laminated rifles often, unfortunately, cross to their detriment. The stock has a tough synthetic finish to protect it from the elements. It also has a black forearm tip, a black pistol grip cap, a solid rubber butt pad and studs for detachable sling swivels. It is checkered in a generous and deeply laser cut point pattern that wraps completely around the forearm. Calibers offered in 2008 are .270 Winchester, .280 Remington, 7mm-08 and .30-06.
Remington Model 700 rifles have always had an excellent reputation for accuracy and that has been my experience with them. To this day the deluxe models remain among the best shooting and nicest looking production rifles on the market.
The Model 700 action was designed for ease of manufacture, given the manufacturing technology of the early 1960's, and uses a round action machined from bar stock, a plunger ejector in the bolt face and a sort of circlip in the bolt face that snaps over the rim of a chambered cartridge to extract the fired brass. The bolt face is recessed to enclose the base of the cartridge, which is also surrounded by the chamber end of the barrel and the front receiver ring. The cartridge head is thus circled by three rings of steel, much as with the Weatherby Mark V action, and this fact was not overlooked by the Remington advertising department.
Traditionalists considered these cost cutting innovations "cheap," but the customers responded in droves to the undeniable good looks of the Model 700 ADL and BDL rifles themselves. They were among the best looking hunting rifles ever introduced and the stock design handled recoil very well, which made them pleasant to shoot. The two position safety (back for "safe" and forward for "fire") at the rear of the action is easy to operate; it used to lock the bolt (to prevent inadvertent opening in the field) as well as the trigger, but the former feature has been eliminated. They were also hell for strong and very accurate. An excellent user-adjustable trigger with the exceptionally fast lock time of 3.0 milliseconds complemented the inherent accuracy of the new rifles.
Remington got a leg up on the market because in 1964 Winchester introduced a revised version of their famous Model 70 rifle--really a new action--also designed for easier manufacture, that pleased practically no one. The new Model 70 was actually a good action, but the stock design, barrel bedding, checkering, and so forth left a lot to be desired. Many previous Winchester customers turned to the sharp looking Model 700 from Remington.
The Model 700 has evolved with the market place and today it is available in a bewildering array of models. Some are pretty plain and some are bespoke rifles turned out to special order in Remington's Custom Gun Shop. Model 700 barreled actions are made from carbon or stainless steel, with matte or polished finishes, and stocked in solid walnut, laminated wood, and synthetic materials. They come in a variety of barrel lengths and contours and for a wide range of cartridges. The constant (at least for the centerfire rifles) is the Model 700 action itself, the heart of every Model 700 rifle.
I have been involved with Model 700 rifles since 1965 and I have lost track of all of the permutations over the years. In 2008 alone the Remington catalog lists some 21 variations of Model 700's, excluding Custom Shop offerings.
It is impossible to chronicle so many models in one article, so I will attempt to describe only a few of the best known and most interesting Model 700 variations. For 2008, the top of the Model 700 line is the CDL (blued barreled action and walnut stock) and CDL SF (stainless/fluted barreled action and walnut stock). CDL models come standard with a hinged magazine floorplate (the release button is inside the front of the trigger guard). The classic style, straight comb stocks are laser cut checkered in a generous pattern and supplied with studs for detachable sling swivels. Both the barreled action and the stock of all CDL models wears a non-glare satin finish. We have reviewed the 2008 Limited Edition version of the Model 700 CDL SF in .260 caliber, so for further details about this model I will simply refer you to the Product review Page.
The Model 700 BDL (which I translate as "B-grade Deluxe") was the flagship of the Model 700 line from its inception until the introduction of the CDL in 2005. BDL models come standard with a hinged magazine floorplate (the release button is inside the front of the trigger guard) or a detachable box magazine ("DM" versions). Stocks are checkered and supplied with studs for detachable sling swivels. Left handed BDL's are available.
The traditional BDL comes with a genuine walnut Monte Carlo style stock which is cut checkered in an attractive skip-line point pattern that wraps around the fore-end. This stock is fitted with a black fore-end tip, pistol grip cap, and black butt plate or recoil pad (in magnum calibers), all set off by white line spacers. The barreled action receives Remington's polished blue finish. An adjustable open rear and hooded ramp front sight are standard. This is Remington's most attractive regular production rifle.
Over the years, the walnut stocked BDL has been available in more calibers than any other Model 700 variation. in 2005 the list included .17 Rem., .222 Rem., .223 Rem., .22-250 Rem., .243 Win., .25-06 Rem., .270 Win., 7mm-08 Rem., .280 Rem., 7mm Rem. Mag., 7mm Ultra Mag, .308 Win., .30-06 Spfd., .300 Win. Mag., .300 Ultra Mag, .338 Win. Mag., .338 Ultra Mag and .375 Ultra Mag, but by 2008 the list had been significently reduced in favor of the newer Model 700 CDL.
There is also a Synthetic Stainless BDL. This version features a matte black synthetic stock with a recoil pad and a satin (silver) stainless steel barreled action without sights. The BDL Synthetic Stainless is a handsome example of a rifle of its type. It is available in calibers .270 Win., 7mm Rem. SAUM, 7mm Rem. Mag., 7mm Ultra Mag, .30-06 Spfd., .300 Rem. SAUM, .300 Win. Mag., .300 Ultra Mag, .338 Win. Mag., .338 Ultra Mag, .375 H&H Mag. and .375 Ultra Mag.
Special long range Model 700's include the Sendero SF and Varmint rifles. The Sendero SF is an ultra-long range big game rifle that features a fluted, stainless steel, heavy barreled action in a special, un-checkered, aramid-fiber-reinforced stock with full length aluminum bedding blocks. Calibers are limited to the various 7mm and .300 Magnums, plus the .338 Ultra Mag.
The three Model 700 Varmint rifles are the 700 VS, a heavy barreled varmint rifle with a fiberglass composite stock; the 700 VLS, a heavy barrel varmint rifle in a laminated wood Monte Carlo style stock; and the 700 VS SF, with a heavy, fluted, stainless steel barreled action in a fiberglass composite stock. None of these stocks are checkered. Calibers include .220 Swift, .223 Rem., .22-250 Rem. and .308 Win. The latter, of course, is not a varmint caliber at all.
An oddity is the Ultimate Lightweight Model 700 Titanium. This features a titanium action mated to a 22" lightweight stainless steel barrel, a fluted bolt, and a very plain, un-checkered, carbon-fiber composite stock. It weighs only 5 1/4 pounds in short action calibers .260 Rem., 7mm-08 Rem. and .308 Win. or 5 1/2 pounds in long action calibers .270 Win. and .30-06 Spfd. Maybe they should have named it the Ultimate Kick Model 700 Titanium!
One of the neatest Model 700's is the Mountain Rifle LSS. The Mountain Rifle LSS is a deluxe model that features a stainless steel barreled action with a slim profile 22" barrel and a slender, modern classic style, laminated hardwood stock. It is what Remington refers to as a "Specialty" rifle. Remington literature says that the Model 700 Mountain Rifle is designed for wilderness or high country pack-in hunts that involve rigorous hiking.
In the Remington world, "LSS" signifies a rifle with laminated wood stock and stainless steel metal parts. The internal magazine has a hinged floorplate with a trigger guard mounted release. The stock is stained a medium walnut brown color. The barreled action is made from satin finished 416 stainless steel. It is a good looking rifle that stops just this side of being gaudy--a line that other stainless/laminated rifles often, unfortunately, cross to their detriment. The stock has a tough synthetic finish to protect it from the elements. It also has a black forearm tip, a black pistol grip cap, a solid rubber butt pad and studs for detachable sling swivels. It is checkered in a generous and deeply laser cut point pattern that wraps completely around the forearm. Calibers offered in 2008 are .270 Winchester, .280 Remington, 7mm-08 and .30-06.
Remington Model 700 rifles have always had an excellent reputation for accuracy and that has been my experience with them. To this day the deluxe models remain among the best shooting and nicest looking production rifles on the market.
Oct 17, 2009 | 01:45 AM
#6
Thread Starter
| Teamspeed Senior Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 698
From: Middle GA, US
I looked at the Remm. 700 on their webpage and it looked pretty good for what I want.
And optics was my next question.
Oct 17, 2009 | 01:48 AM
#7
Banned
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,264
.270 winchester (or weatherby) is a very hard round to beat. I like it a lot more than .30-06 or 700 RM. Nothing wrong with good 'ol .308, either, though it drops a bit more at longer range than some of the "almost magnum" rounds like the .270.
If you reeeeally want to reach out and touch stuff, or want the flexibility of dealing with larger game, .300 winchester (or weatherby) mag are superb, and my personal favorite is .30-378 weatherby. Be warned though that small animals at shorter range will be turned into jell-o by the heavy hitters, and if you're a recoil wussy, you might not be as accurate as you would be with a .270 or smaller.
As for what sort of rifle, it largely depends on what fits and what you like. Try a bunch on for size. It's hard to argue with the venerable Remington 700. I'm a Weatherby whore when it comes to sporting rifles, though. You pay a bit more, though the plastic accumarks are not hugely more expensive than most other things out there, and the quality is very much on another level.
I wouldn't bother with all the bipods and 4958x optics and tacticool black stuff, though. Chances are extremely good you'll be shooting freehand, so get something light that fits. That will generally not be a pseudo-sniper rifle with a massive bull barrel and heavy bipod stuck on the end.
My personal favorite all-rounder is an old (late 60's) Parker-Hale 1200 Super in .270. Beautiful walnut stock, shoots very flat. I've dispatched more than a few Bambis with it.
Oct 17, 2009 | 01:51 AM
#8
Banned
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,264
And optics was my next question.
Last edited by Simba; Oct 17, 2009 at 01:55 AM.
Oct 17, 2009 | 02:45 AM
#9
Teamspeed Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 79
I would take a look at the Tikka. I bought a Tikka Lite in 308 so I can start hunting and it is a nice light gun. 6.5lbs with a scope! It's so lite it hurts like a bitch though... but if you need to hike and walk around, the weight is great. Cost around $500 without the scope too.
